My Honest Experience With Dating Coaches (Part 1)
Having interviewed, worked with or collaborated with many dating coaches and pickup artists from Mystery and Ross Jeffries to Dan Bilzerian and Michael Sartain, here are my opinions on them.
Ice White’s Experience Working With Dating Coaches
Ross Jeffries
I met Ross Jeffries in-person in 2018, in London, for what was supposed to be his last ever interview in the seduction community before retiring from his career as a dating coach.
The greatest thing I have ever learned from Ross Jeffries was his idea on how to treat approach anxiety.
Ross Jeffries gave the best advice for approach anxiety that I have ever heard. His idea is that you should replace ‘approach anxiety’ in your head with ‘opportunity hesitation’. So when the opportunity presents itself in the form of a beautiful woman nearby, you simply take the opportunity to meet, rather than stifle yourself with anxiety. If only I saw things this way years earlier when I needed it the most. Ross emphasizes that how you structure and word things in your mind ultimately determines your thoughts and behaviors.
Ross Jeffries can be a hard-ass sometimes. But he is a very genuine and kind person once you get to know him, and he has dedicated his life to discover techniques for seduction as well as for sales.
Mystery
I first found out about Erik Von Markovik (Mystery) through Neil Strauss’s book The Game, having read it in 2016. My interview with Mystery in 2024 was over 4 hours long and became the longest ever Mystery interview.
One of the most useful and interesting lessons I learned from Mystery is what he calls ‘the flinch test’.
In a nutshell, the flinch test is designed to confirm to you whether she is chasing you or if she is repelling from you. One way you can try this is by leaning in closer to a girl during your interaction with her. Does she lean back from you? And if you lean back, does she lean towards you? These are subtle signs, or indicators of interest, you can test for in a girl’s behavior.
Another good technique Mystery has is moving locations when on dates or hanging out with women (To me, it’s the same thing). Sometimes he talks about going to 5 different locations with a girl, but it doesn’t have to be that many. If you just take to mind that the girl is following you from one place to another, that’s the key to knowing whether or not she’s truly into you, and it makes it easier to take her home when you already know she has been following you lead the whole time.
Erik Von Markovik (Mystery) is very wholesome, unlike many dating coaches. He’s always pleasant to talk to.
Definitely check out Mystery’s books.
You can also get a special discount on coaching by using the code ICE for Mystery’s bootcamps and events.
Michael Sartain
I started collaborating with Michael Sartain in 2021, bringing out lots of clips about social circle game to the pickup community. We finally met each other in-person in 2023, in Las Vegas.
It all started when I felt compelled to reach out to Michael Sartain and have him on the Game Global YouTube channel. He suggested that I interview him during one of his Monday Zoom calls that he did for free every week. Thus, I ended up hijacking his Zoom calls every few months, and released clips of my questions and his answers. Together, we introduced a lot of social circle game content to the pickup artist audience; a topic not very widely talked about or popularized in the community until the videos started coming out.
I find Michael Sartain to be one of the most respectable and honest dating coaches out there. He is a man of his word. And he is the trailblazer of social circle game in recent years. He mixes social circle game with night game and message game, ultimately creating a lifestyle system that is extremely efficient and ever-growing. Michael talked about the importance of virtual presence, a message game concept, years ago when famous pickup artists of the time ignored social media and even criticized it. Thus, Michael Sartain was smart enough to be ahead of the curve and recognize the power of the social media component of message game, and its real applications in dating, social proof and lifestyle. Before it was cool.
However, some people get the wrong impression of Michael Sartain and social circle game in general. Some people take one look at Michael Sartain’s content and falsely believe that social circle game requires big titty bikini models, living in Las Vegas and paying women… Paying women is the antithesis of game and has no part in social circle game or what Michael Sartain does. As for Las Vegas and big titty bikini models, that’s just Michael’s taste. Your version of game could be hanging out with goth girls in alternative clubs and hosting goth-themed picnics. Or something in fashion, or photography, or designed around the type of women you like. Design it around you.
There are many good lessons I have taken from Michael Sartain’s perspective. A super important one that millions of men are confused about is to do with how to know if a girl is actually, truly interested in you. All the time, guys get confused because a girl showed ‘signs’ or ‘indicators of interest’, yet didn’t have sex or see her ever again, or get a reply. Maybe she sent nudes on Instagram. Maybe she touched her hair and licked her lips. Or maybe she seemed just so interested in you that it doesn’t make sense that she would suddenly just ghost you. Michael highlights that there is a distinction between attention and compliance. Anything above the waist is attention, and below the waist is compliance.
If she sent you nudes, she used her thumbs to send them. So she was looking for attention.
If she said words that turn you on, she used her mouth to speak them. So she was looking for attention.
If she comes over to your house, she used her legs to get there. So she gave you compliance.
Ultimately, the truest sign, or ‘indicator of interest’, is compliance. Women don’t just show up at your door for no reason. Thus, if you’re able to get a woman to come home with you, it’s almost a done deal already. She made a very conscious decision to come to your house, and she used her legs to get there, which she controls continuously using her brain.
All in all, I definitely recommend Michael Sartain and his Men Of Action program.
Todd V
I must have met Todd VanDeHey (Todd V) in 2016 or 2017 when he hosted an event for Real Social Dynamics as RSD Todd. We met several times after that, particularly out doing night game in a place I recommended. We never talked to each other that much, but we would acknowledge each other if we were in the same place.
Personally, I found his videos hard to watch when I was starting out. He is a very technical person and it’s not quite my learning style. However, he was way ahead of his time when he started doing 60 second videos explaining certain concepts or giving advice packaged very neatly. This was years before YouTube Shorts existed, before TikTok was a thing and before Instagram Reels.
I would love to interview him and have him on the Dating Coach Panel. He just doesn’t seem very collaborative in general.
Mr Locario
Hashim Locario Smith (Mr Locario) first came onto the Dating Coach Panel on the Game Global YouTube channel in 2024. I was introduced to him through a mutual connection and didn’t know he existed prior to that. I didn’t know what to think of him at first and his words went straight over my head until I listened back to them when editing clips out of the videos.
The first thing that struck me was when he said that women having sex with a man because of his money are also having sex with a man for free. Only when I listened to it the second or third time did I realize he was speaking nothing but facts. He just has a different communication style…
Mr Locario is always happy to show up and is very collaborative. Sometimes he comes across a little argumentative in debates or discussions with other dating coaches, but even at the end of the most brutal debates, he is clearly very friendly and positive to everyone. It’s always fun having him on, and this probably explains his very passionate and loyal audience.
Mr 1950
Mr 1950 closely collaborates with Mr Locario and first appeared in the Mr Locario VS Ablaze debate on the Game Global YouTube channel. I don’t know too much about him, but he has some very wholesome but interesting insights, and is hilarious at the same time.
Steve ‘The Dean’ Williams
Steve ‘The Dean’ Williams can be extremely argumentative, especially in debates, but he can have his super positive and wholesome moments too. He brings a very heavy handed, red hot take to his appearances. He’s fierce but friendly.
John Anthony Lifestyle
I had a somewhat positive standing with John Mulvehill (John Anthony Lifestyle) in 2020, having been featured in 2 of his videos about my dispute with Real Social Dynamics.
However, he started attacking me after I told him in 2023 that some dating coaches were interested in debating him. And in 2024, we went to war with each other on YouTube, in what became an epic beef saga.
In 2025, John Anthony Lifestyle’s YouTube channel was terminated.
And like many others, I celebrated.
Markus Wolf
Markus Wolf first came onto my radar in 2023, and famously battled Michael Sartain in a cold approach VS social circle game debate. It was the first ever debate on Game Global, and it was one of the reasons the Game Global channel began to see some huge growth. The debate was so crazy, even Dan Bilzerian and some other famous figures joined it. Unfortunately we had to cut out some parts because of the involvement of some very notable celebrities and figures in Hollywood who joined in.
Because of the debate, he was effectively introduced to Dan Bilzerian and became a one of the dating coaches for Dan Bilzerian’s Sigma Society program. And when I was visiting Dan Bilzerian in Las Vegas in 2023, I had a rush of guys come up to me outside XS in Wynn Casino, recognizing me from the debate I hosted between Markus Wolf and Michael Sartain.
Markus can explain things in such a clear and nuanced way, it’s intriguing to watch. And he doesn’t even need to stop for a second to think about it. He has a wealth of experience in dating and very fascinating insights. He definitely knows what he’s talking about.
There are many good lessons I can attribute to Markus Wolf. But the first one I remember was a simple point about marriage, divorce and business. He made the point that most businesses fail within a certain number of years, and the percentage is higher than the percentage of marriages which end up in divorce. So you shouldn’t be discouraged from getting into relationships (Stage 2 of game) for the same reason you shouldn’t be discouraged from starting a business.
Markus Wolf was voted Best Pickup Artist 2023 and Best Pickup Artist 2025.
Check out Markus Wolf’s bootcamps.
Justin Marc
I almost met Justin Marc in Toronto in 2019, but we finally met in London in 2022 and then again in Lima in 2024.
He is a short Indian guy from Canada, and he’s a very positive-minded guy. There was a time when we had a minor clash over something several years ago, but we both saw past it and our friendship became much stronger after that. So this tells me he is a man of dignity, who doesn’t take things personally and genuinely sees things a similar way that I do.
I went to a party of his in Lima in 2024. He was visiting the city, and I moved to Lima for a third and more permanent time just a few months before. All the girls there were beautiful, and there were more girls than guys. I got to see firsthand how effortlessly Justin does things. He combines social circle game (Parties/dinners) with message game (Tinder/Instagram), which makes it easy for him to just invite women to whatever he’s doing. He’s super chill, and while he is joking around some of the time, at other times he’s just relaxing on the sofa while girls try all kinds of things to get his attention. This is a reality of game that most guys will never witness nor understand, and most guys go through life never even tasting it.
Justin also got to see the kinds of things I do. I didn’t even notice until he pointed it out, but I was literally doing game almost entirely in Spanish with the Peruvian and Venezuelan girls that were there. And it just didn’t quite occur to me before that I could now speak Spanish at a better level. I was even making political jokes and puns in Spanish that only South Americans or Limeñas would understand.
And I even joked to one of the girls that Justin was my cousin from the famous North American city of ‘Mumbai-Toronto’. I had to throw in a Canadian inside joke to balance it out, knowing it would go straight over her head. Meanwhile, Justin nearly dropped his phone, laughing.
Overall, two of the girls were chasing me, but I was rejecting them and playing with them the whole time. Catch and release, as I am a loyal married man. But it’s always fascinating to see how women behave even when you tell them you’re married, they see your wedding ring, they see your profiles, etc.
We did a video together perhaps one or two days after that, but unfortunately the audio cut out after a few minutes. We went deeper discussing social circle game.
Justin Marc is a unique guy who is such a great case study for guys who make excuses about their height and ethnicity. While so many guys complain about being too short or being Indian, Justin is having chilled out parties with women begging for his attention.
Dan Bilzerian
Dan Bilzerian isn’t so much a dating coach, but he is a pretty extreme example of a guy. Big trucks, machine guns and yachts. But let’s forget about that for a minute, even if that’s pretty difficult to separate from his personality and lifestyle.
The Setup is the book Dan Bilzerian released in 2021, and while it’s an autobiography, it has some gold nuggets in there. In particular, Dan Bilzerian designs his social circle game (Parties/events/activities) and message game (Instagram) in a way that works in a man’s favor to the extreme. He aims for ratios of at least 7 women to 1 man for his parties, and this causes women to chase the men. He uses status, preselection and social proof to his advantage. Hence the title of the book ‘The Setup’; he designs and sets things up in such a way that causes women to chase.
As for the money part, he sees money as a tool that can be used to facilitate things that help you attract women.
I met Dan Bilzerian in-person in 2023 at his mansion in Las Vegas. It would have been awesome to have a photo of the two of us, but I would rather not act like a tourist in his own home. But if I am going to boast… He bought a copy of my book, The Message Game.
He’s very eccentric and says what he wants. He lives in his own Universe. But he is way more interesting than he lets on.
Check out Dan Bilzerian’s Sigma Society program.
Alex Vilenchik
For the most part, Alex Vilenchik (Playing With Fire) was my most similar competitor among all the dating coaches I had seen. He was running a big YouTube channel before I even had any traction on YouTube, and was pumping out lots of videos of message game (Messaging/online dating/social media) advice. Especially Tinder advice. He has his big channel and various courses, and I have my bestselling book and AI wingman for online dating. So I generally avoided collaborating with because there may have been some very obvious conflicts of interest.
However, we started collaborating anyway since 2023. He has been on the Dating Coach Panel, and I have been on his YouTube channel.
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